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The UK government denialist position challenged

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  • The UK government denialist position challenged

    Armenia Solidarity
    c/p The Temple of POeace, Cathays Park, Cardiff
    Email: [email protected]
    Tel: 07718982732

    The UK government denialist position is challanged by "Solidarity with
    the Victims of All Genocides"

    The following response was sent to Baroness Kinnock, minster of State at
    the Foreign Office(The UK government spokesperson on Armenian and
    Turkish affairs) by Eilian Williams of "Solidarity with the Victims of
    All Genocides",challanging 14 of her assertions made in the House of
    Lords debate this week. Below is her contribution to the Armenia debate
    follwed by the responses in italics and in brackets

    The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Baroness Kinnock
    of Holyhead):At the outset, I reaffirm that the Government deeply regret
    the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Armenians who were either killed
    by Ottoman troops or died from starvation or disease at the beginning of
    the previous century.

    1 ( you have omitted "during the forced marches into the deserts of
    Syria)

    We share the view expressed today that the victims of such suffering
    should not be forgotten.

    2 (Then why will you not accept the invitation to the Monument in
    Cardiff- Baroness Cox extended to you an olive branch and you have
    saddened all UK Armenians by rejecting it)

    The fate of ethnic Armenians and smaller Christian minorities,
    including the Assyrians, living in the Ottoman Empire at the time was
    roundly and robustly condemned by the British Government.

    3 ((The only record of this condemnation by the government in Hansard
    is this by Lord Cecil on October 21 1915. Do you still stand by this?"I
    think it may be said,without the least fear of exaggeration, that no
    more horrible crime has been committed in the history of the world.....
    This is a premeditive crime determined on long ago. It is part of the
    deliberate policy... it was a long-considered, deliberate policy to
    destroy and wipe out of existance the Armenians in Turkey. It was
    systematically carried out . It was ordered from above , and when, as
    happened on one or two ocassions, the local governors were anxious to
    spare some of the children, or mitigate in some degree the horrors of
    the operation, they were sternly ordered to go on with the work.... Not
    only was this premeditated. There was no provocation whatsoever.....
    There was no insurrection, no riot... The crime was a deliberate one ,
    not to punish insurrection but to destroy the Armenian race.")

    I confirm that the position of the Government is to continue to work for
    rapprochement and reconciliation between Turkey and Armenia. In October
    2009, two protocols were signed by the Foreign Ministers of both
    countries, agreeing a framework for the normalisation of relations and
    the opening of borders. This represents a landmark step in progressing
    better relations between the two countries. Signing the protocols-a
    number of noble Lords alluded to this-was not an easy step for either
    country, and ratification will remain sensitive. The UK Government will
    not make any statements that have the potential to jeopardise this
    process
    4 .(The Armenian Foreign Minister signed thje Protocols without
    preconditiobns in order to open the border and remove the economic
    blockade by Turkey. It is Turkey who is trying to link ratification to
    Karabagh and stopping Armenia from lobbying for Genocide Recognition)
    It is apparent that there is a strong political will, and indeed popular
    support, for improving relations. The Armenian president and the Turkish
    president have been focused and engaged in the process, which also
    allows for the creation of a sub-committee to examine historical issues,
    including the events of 1915-17.

    5 (The Armenian President has written to the President of the
    International Association of Genocide Scholars assuring him that Armenia
    sees the role of the Comission as investigating the effects of the
    Genocide not investigating whether there was a Genocide. In all of this
    you are of course following British interests by siding with the strong
    against the weak)

    I shall now answer some of the questions that noble Lords asked. I say
    to the noble Baroness, Lady Cox, that Geoffrey Robertson concluded that
    while the 1948 UN Convention on Genocide could not be applied
    retrospectively, the term "genocide" should be applied to the Armenian
    massacres. "Genocide" is a precise term and its use is best assessed by
    a competent court. However, then as now, there is no court with the
    authority to make such an assessment. Therefore, it is inappropriate for
    the British Government to apply the term to events on which no legal
    judgment can be made.

    6 ( Actions such as the murder of Abel by Cain happen before words
    are invented to describe such actions. It is well known that Lemkin
    coined the term Genocide to describe what happened to the Armenians.Does
    coining a word to describe an action prevent its use to describe the
    action which inspired its invention? One need not be a Philosophy
    Graduate to follow this logic.)

    I was aware last year that noble Lords had raised the issue of a
    memorial. Sending a government representative might suggest recognition,
    so, despite our sympathies for the tragedy, we do not intend to send a
    representative.

    7 (The Government has said before that its policy is not determined
    by other countries. We now take that you are too fearful to lay flowers
    to respect the memory of the 1.5 million victims in case Turkey realises
    that you accept your own government's position on 21st October 1915 on
    this crime of systematic extermination of the Armenians)

    The Government reject any suggestion that Parliament has been misled,

    8 ( an easy statement to make but you make no attempt to defend
    yourselves against the damning evidence against the government in Mr
    Robertson's Legal Opinion)

    but I will also make it perfectly clear that Ministers, not officials,
    are responsible for the statements that they make to Parliament.( if
    this is so why do you contradict your own voting record in the European
    Parliament in favour of Recognition)

    The noble Baroness, Lady Cox, referred to recent resolutions and
    decisions in the US Congress and the Swedish Riksdag. Those have not
    changed the UK Government's view that it is for the Turkish and Armenian
    people to address the issue together.

    9 ( Britain's Foreign Policy in the 18th century led to Armenians
    being exposed to Genocide. Russia was persuaded to yeild its role as
    protector of the Armenians in order to serve British Imperial Interests.
    Lloyd George said in 1932 (in "The Truth about Peace Treaties " : "The
    actions of this (British ) government led to the massacres of 1894-96,
    1909, and worst of all to the Holocaust of 1915") I will send you my "
    Britain's 30 betrayals of the Armenians" to convince you of our
    involvement. Also Britain signed the Lausanne treaty,in a way
    legitimazing the genocide. Turkey's present borders are a reward for its
    very succesful Genocide of the Armenians and Assyrians.This was probably
    the most succesful Genocide in history. If there was no Genocide, then
    Western (Turkish) Armenia still exists. But Turkey denies that Turkish
    Armenia exists.

    Neither the US nor the Swedish Government has changed its position as a
    result of these votes.

    The noble Lord, Lord Avebury, referred to the Blue Book, with which he
    has a long association. As he pointed out, it contains many compelling
    reports of eye-witness accounts of the events in question. It should be
    considered alongside other documents relating to the events of 1915-16
    in archives around the world. Our embassy in Ankara can certainly assist
    in passing on a letter from UK parliamentarians to their Turkish
    counterparts inviting dialogue over the validity of the Blue Book. I
    understand that officials have already been in touch with the noble Lord
    to take this forward It remains our view, with regard to those events,
    that the greatest need is for dialogue between Turks and Armenians.

    10 ( Turkish identity is built on a myth that there was no Genocide,
    and there never was a Western Armenia. So where can any dialogue start
    without Turkey being helped by friendly countries (the chief of which
    seems to be the UK) to face their Armenian past and their "crime of
    destroyng the Armenian race"- your government's words not mine)

    However, on the issue of parliamentarians, in which the noble Lord,
    Lord Avebury, has been extremely engaged, we can do only so much to
    encourage Turkish parliamentarians to engage on the issue. I fear that,
    to date, their response to the idea of a conference has been somewhat
    negative, but of course any progress on such a front would be very
    welcome and would represent more of the reconciliation which we all
    want.

    The noble Lord, Lord Hylton, and other noble Lords raised the issue of
    deportations. Prime Minister Erdogan and the Foreign Minister have now
    clarified that there is no immediate plan to deport illegal Armenian
    immigrants from Turkey. President Gül has also clarified that Turkey
    does not discriminate against Armenians working in Turkey.

    11 ( Turkey is not even tolerant of the crypto-Armenians- the
    grand-children of Genocide survivors who were forcibly Islamized. Has
    the government ever looked into this minority? )

    Subsequent comments by Turkish politicians have underlined the
    tolerance shown by Turkey towards migrants. I repeat that it is for the
    Turkish Government to manage migration issues and illegal immigration in
    line with their international obligations and Turkish law.

    On EU membership, which several noble Lords raised, the issue that we
    are discussing today is not a precondition for Turkish membership of the
    European Union. However, under the political criteria for membership,
    Turkey is expected to maintain what is called in the criteria "good
    neighbourly relations" with countries in the region, which of course
    include Armenia. The issue of Nagorno-Karabakh was raised by noble
    Lord, Lord Maginnis, and others.

    13 If Nagorno Karabagh comes into the equation, then so does
    Turkish-occupied Armenia (over 90% of historic Armenian land-mass)

    The Presidents of Armenia and Azerbaijan have had useful and
    constructive meetings in the framework of the Minsk group process,
    including, most recently, at the end of January. We hope for continuing
    progress. On the issue of our contacts, my honourable friend Chris
    Bryant, Minister for Europe, discussed Turkey-Armenia relations with his
    Turkish counterpart during the Turkish Prime Minister's recent visit,
    and he lobbied his counterpart in January and February this year to
    encourage progress on the normalisation of relations with Armenia.

    The noble Baroness, Lady Rawlings, raised a number of points. I may not
    get round to them all, but if there is anything that I have not covered
    in my response, she may expect me to give her a written answer as soon
    as possible. Politically, the UK Government continue to urge both the
    Armenian and Turkish Governments to move forward with the normalisation
    process and to find ways to reconcile their differences. The Foreign
    Secretary recently raised the issue with the Armenian President, we have
    had many discussions with foreign ministers and others and, in-country,
    our ambassadors are engaging on the issues.

    14 You have made the Genocide issue as one which concerns Turkey and
    the Armenian Republic. It concerns the 10million descendants of Genocide
    survivors world -wide, over 20,000 of whom live in the UK and who are
    dismayed by your comments. Please re-think the invitation to the
    Monument in Cardiff before the election.

    I would also seek to offer a compromise. The term Holocaust has been
    used by Lloyd George, Churchill and the New York Times to describe the
    Armenian experience.Is this term more acceptable to you? Or would you
    prefer your own government's wording on October 21st 1915 of
    "premeditive crime ....a deliberate policy to destroy and wipe out of
    existance the Armenians in Turkey.... systematically carried out"
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